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Author Topic: skylight and UV Filters?  (Read 2274 times)

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Offline adri

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skylight and UV Filters?
« on: November 09, 2010, 01:20:09 PM »
Just read an article which reckons you shouldn't use them as they add two more glass surfaces for the light to go through.

It recommends a lens hood instead.

I'd be interested in thoughts on this.  And if it is a good idea where would you get a hood for a panasonic 20mm?  Sounds distinctly odd a hood on a pancake lens.

Adri

Offline popo

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2010, 01:59:41 PM »
A hood primarily prevents flare from out-of-shot light hitting the lens. Only as a side effect it provides some mechanical protection of the lens, but the glass remains exposed.

The filters listed don't really serve their original functions of adjusting the colour or blocking UV, but do serve as a physical block protecting the lens glass front.

The question is, do you think you really need protection which is met by either or even both cases.

A hood could in theory improve image quality in some cases, and at worst does nothing (as long as it isn't too small!). The filter at best does nothing to the image, and at worse can increase flare, glare, alter colour or even add distortion.

Other practical considerations may apply, like physical size of a hood...

I had a Hoya HMC UV(O) filter on my Panasonic 20mm for a long time. I've stopped using it as I found I needed to remove it all the time for night shooting. That is a relatively good filter too, so don't expect finding something that much better. If the lens breaks, the lens breaks, I'll just have to be more careful. Only dropped the E-P1 one ever.
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Offline n2hhr

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2010, 03:03:27 PM »
ANY glass in front of the lens will always reduce image quality, buy good filters!! (B+W, Singhray, Heliopan...).

The lens hood will stop light from extreme angles from striking the objective lens. Any light that does this will cause a DECREASE in lens contrast and reduce image quality! For this reason alone you should ALWAYS use a lens hood!
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Tercha

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2010, 03:12:48 PM »
It depends where you use your camera in my opinion, for exclusive studio work I would probably not use a filter as it is a controlled environment , however i carry the camera and lenses EVERYWHERE so spending a few dollars on a filter for protection of the lens seems economic sense.

Panther

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2010, 04:01:31 PM »
ANY glass in front of the lens will always reduce image quality, buy good filters!! (B+W, Singhray, Heliopan...)


Agreed.
My filters are Heliopan & B+W .....

Offline rogerml

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2010, 05:08:07 PM »
Then my Olympus 14-42 kit lens' filter (PRF-D40.5), - which I had a hell of a lot of trouble to find hereabout, - and costed US$50, - is 'no good'?  Doesn't stand to reason, doe's it?
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Offline mikmas101

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2010, 05:50:16 PM »
Used UV filters on my 40/50 year old Pentax and Rollei for years - never had a problem and kept the lenses in good nick(sold both Takumars a couple of months back with not a scratch on them)

Never owned a hood for either cameras - but I do have eyes and  a pair of hands.
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Offline n2hhr

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2010, 05:51:37 PM »
Then my Olympus 14-42 kit lens' filter (PRF-D40.5), - which I had a hell of a lot of trouble to find hereabout, - and costed US$50, - is 'no good'?  Doesn't stand to reason, doe's it?
There are levels of good.  But with filters you get what you pay for. It is not uncommon to pay several hundred dollars for a good filter but a uv is on the lower end of the cost charts.  In the case of the kit lens I would  not bother with a protection filter as there is a point of diminishing returns.  To protect the lens, use a lens cap till you are ready to shoot or invest in a lens hood for a little more protection. 

Good/no-good and optics very rarely have any impact on reason and cost. It is what it is..... Each and EVERY layer of glass you place in the optic path impacts the image in a negative fashion so if you want the best quality you invest in the best glass (German schott glass, multiple coatings and so on. Which adds up quickly).  Like I said earlier, uv filters from the best makers are on the low end of the cost scale. 

You also do not want a $150 filter on a $100 lens!

I put NO FILTERS on my lenses unless they are needed for artistic intent (like an IR or polarizer).  I have lenses that range from $200 to $10,000 and would not ever consider a protection filter. To me a lens is a tool and I want it to generate the best images possible!
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Panther

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2010, 06:18:09 PM »
To piggy back on "n2hhr"'s statements....

"Why pay hundreds or thousands of dollars for a finely engineered lens only to put a $20 non-perfect filter on it?"

I'm in total agreement with "n2hhr".  I rarely use filters and in the rare case that I do, I use a top quality filter...
« Last Edit: November 09, 2010, 06:19:44 PM by Panther »

Offline popo

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #9 on: November 10, 2010, 12:58:19 AM »
LOL "to filter or not to filter" probably ranks alongside "Nikon vs Canon" and "PC vs Mac" discussions on t'net :D Just know the strengths and weaknesses and use them appropriately and everything will be fine.
Cameras big and small: Sony HX9V, Olympus E-P1, Canon 300D (IR mod), 7D and many others!

Offline peterb666

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #10 on: November 10, 2010, 03:37:42 AM »
Just read an article which reckons you shouldn't use them as they add two more glass surfaces for the light to go through.

It recommends a lens hood instead.

I'd be interested in thoughts on this.  And if it is a good idea where would you get a hood for a panasonic 20mm?  Sounds distinctly odd a hood on a pancake lens.

Adri

It is sound avice. The only time I fit a UV filter is when I am shooting with wind driven sea spray heading towards the front of the camera.
Be nice to each other, life is too short for anything else.

Offline adri

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #11 on: November 10, 2010, 04:36:35 AM »
given that my primary lens is the 20mm panasonic could anyone recommend a lens hood?

TIA

Adri

Offline lisandra

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #12 on: November 10, 2010, 08:41:25 AM »
I always put a UV filter over my lens (hoya), It keeps the glass clean and protected so if at any point I decide to sell I can say the glass has never been touched, so it's like new, and the buyers appreciate it a lot. A filter you can replace easily. Plus if you buy a good quality multicoated filter, what you loose in image quality nobody in the world will notice, it's less than 1%.
More megapixels don't necessarily mean more resolution...

Panther

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2010, 09:40:21 AM »

Offline lisandra

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #14 on: November 10, 2010, 09:54:50 AM »
Here's an interesting read  ;)
--> http://desmond-downs.blogspot.com/2010/04/cheap-filters-and-bokeh.html

In the end of the post he states that when using a good quality hoya filter, he couldn't notice the difference.
More megapixels don't necessarily mean more resolution...

Offline lisandra

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #15 on: November 10, 2010, 10:01:35 AM »
And I just tested what he said about the filter eating away 1/3 of a stop in exposure. It's not true. To me this is just like the post that talks about front teleconverters, things have changed quite a bit and companies like hoya and BW use quality multicoated glass that do less than 1% of anything to an image.
I mean, don't use them if u don't want to, its understandable even, but if you do want to, a good quality filter won't do any harm.
P.S. and that moon shot comparison is ridiculous, what was he using for a filter??
More megapixels don't necessarily mean more resolution...

Offline adri

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #16 on: November 10, 2010, 12:22:49 PM »
glad to be the font of polemic.

still can't decide to rip off the cheap UV filter from the panny 20mm...

it was kind of pricey and the idea behind the filter was to protect an expensive item.

Adri

Offline mikmas101

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #17 on: November 10, 2010, 12:57:22 PM »
it's less than 1%.

...and definitely less than the haze from repeatedly cleaning the front lens element (preferably with your shirt)

I'm with you on the Hoya UV - never noticed any weirdness.; nor from Cokin.
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Panther

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #18 on: November 10, 2010, 05:50:17 PM »

Offline lisandra

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #19 on: November 10, 2010, 10:14:06 PM »
it's less than 1%.

...and definitely less than the haze from repeatedly cleaning the front lens element (preferably with your shirt)

I'm with you on the Hoya UV - never noticed any weirdness.; nor from Cokin.
It gives me peace of mind too. I can go to the beach, shoot all I want, go home, and dip the filter in water and that's it. Without thinking about how am I gonna remove the salt from the lens without damaging it.
More megapixels don't necessarily mean more resolution...

Offline adri

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Re: skylight and UV Filters?
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2010, 09:30:05 AM »
Well I decided to try out a hood.  £4.99 from ebay a rubber thingy and I quite liked taking off the cheap UV filter.

Knowing my luck tomorrow I'll probably end up with spots of mud on the front element...


 

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