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Author Topic: Not a "Tweaked" sensor  (Read 2962 times)

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Offline count_zero

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Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« on: July 07, 2011, 09:26:45 PM »
From the facebook QA session today.

Quote
Hi, is the 12 Megapixel Sensor from the E-P3 a tweaked sensor from E-P2?? because base on the online review, the noise still suffer which ISO above 1600, and Panasonic already improved their noise control in there new sensor. and is it the same sensor use in E-5??

Get Olympus
Quote
No, the sensor is nothing like the one in the E-PL2. Redesigned entirely. The noise is better at higher ISOs. It's different from that in the E-5 as well. It truly is something to see for yourself..

Offline asterinex

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2011, 10:06:38 PM »
I hope they improve the noise issues until release. That is my only concern.
For the rest it looks like a dream:)
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Panther

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2011, 03:43:22 AM »
I hope they improve the noise issues until release. That is my only concern.
For the rest it looks like a dream:)

Yep
I don't see much difference in comparison with my E-PL2,,,,
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 03:53:03 AM by Panther »

Offline adash

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2011, 03:49:12 AM »
Indeed, no point in buying that camera for the moment (yes, even I admit it):

http://dpreview.com/previews/olympusep3/page11.asp
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Offline cosinaphile

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2011, 06:25:26 AM »
its scary how smeary and bad the 1so 3200 looks, am i  crazy or does the ep1 generallly look better across the iso spectrum?

i really want to love this camera , whats going on here , ????

Offline niva_explorer_photo

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2011, 06:43:29 AM »
Do you really shoot pictures at ISO 3200?
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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2011, 07:04:28 AM »
I know I don't, ISO 1600 is really plenty for almost anything, even at f/5.6 indoors
But, to gain more DOF inside or on dark streets, it may be an advantage.. but, in RAW, you can overexpose 1/stop and bring it back later w/o a lot of IQ lose in the Highlights.
I think the E-P3 may have a better performance tweak for the initial release date
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 07:07:45 AM by M5-User »
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Offline cosinaphile

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2011, 07:13:55 AM »
Do you really shoot pictures at ISO 3200?

theres many times when id like to be able to... movement at dusk ...panning from a train in less than great light
some action work with slower zooms

the reason i rarely shoot  at 3200 iso isnt because i dont need it at times, its because the quality isnt there

when in have the x 100 in hand i may shoot alot more and higher isos
of course thats a personal perspective

and id much rather expose a shot at iso 200,,im not insane ....maybe a littlle

Offline niva_explorer_photo

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2011, 07:49:35 AM »
I always shoot at ISO 200, I think I must have only a few shots at ISO800  :P
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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2011, 08:35:35 AM »
Do you really shoot pictures at ISO 3200?

Yes...
Night soccer & baseball games are just a couple of examples... :)

Offline lisandra

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2011, 08:58:40 AM »
Do you really shoot pictures at ISO 3200?
yes I do. But I admit, that's a very good question. Some people will criticize for the heck of it.
More megapixels don't necessarily mean more resolution...

Offline count_zero

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2011, 10:18:15 AM »

Offline cosinaphile

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2011, 10:50:56 AM »
Good sample of ISO comparison on the E-P3.

http://fourthirds-user.com/2011/07/micro_four_thirds_high_iso_noise_compared_g1_ep2_ep3.php



nice find i wish they included something 3 dimensional like a doll face  the cooking algorythms seem to handle
flat art and  3 d contours with eyes and lashes differently or they seem to in my

will return to answer the questoon they pose?

running now

Offline lisandra

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2011, 11:53:02 AM »
I don't get people... I've been reading a year of complaints about the AF speed and dynamic range of the pen. Now oly has camera that focuses faster than the NIKON d3, Canon 7d and even their own e5 and most people didn't even mention it. It has more DR than ANY current m43s camera to date and I haven't read one.SINGLE. post. about it. Let's get over it, if you're gonna shoot over ISO 1600 just shoot raw and get the output you want. This sensor is better than the ep2 hands down. The gh2 jpeg engine is even crappier; I have phenomenal ISO 3200, 5000, and 6400s. How? I shot raw and worked on them. Go get a pen and enjoy the resolution, AF speed, and DR ; and when the sun goes down shoot raw and keep enjoying those things.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 12:28:39 PM by lisandra »
More megapixels don't necessarily mean more resolution...

Offline asterinex

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2011, 12:25:28 PM »
That is true. It is a hell of a camera and perfect for people to get into m4/3 system. But in my case, 50% of the time I have mf legacy lens on it. And if iq is not much better than E-p1 than I skip this one too. The E-p1 is a great cam after all. Btw. I hate noise. That is my case. For people shooting af lenses this is a perfect fast portable cam.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 12:28:00 PM by asterinex »
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Offline Agent00soul

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2011, 12:56:45 PM »
DPReview has a couple of new samples at 3200 and 1600 iso up now. I must say these look fabulous. I can't understand what people complain about. Even the 3200 iso shot would look excellent in print.

Offline popo

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2011, 01:07:43 PM »
While of course I wouldn't turn down something better, the E-P1 was decent at ISO1600 already. Improvements in anyone's sensor since then haven't really changed that much beyond obsessive pixel peeping.

I certainly did welcome the fast AF. I don't care about the faster than (insert DSLR here) comparisons though, since they're not like for like. And for one shot, beyond a point it doesn't matter how fast it it. We have crossed that point. Job done. Move onto the next feature improvement like continuous shooting depth motion tracking AF.
Cameras big and small: Sony HX9V, Olympus E-P1, Canon 300D (IR mod), 7D and many others!

Offline count_zero

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2011, 01:22:33 PM »
I'm hoping for pre-cognitive continuous tracking AF, or possessed by the spirit of Henri Cartier-Bresson AF.  That way all of my shots will be exactly framed and in focus no matter how badly I screw up.

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2011, 01:48:11 PM »
This thread is turning hilarious to me now.... :D

Offline cosinaphile

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2011, 07:32:43 PM »
the ep3 is a good enough machine that ill be getting one

lisandra your points are golden , the fastest af  anywhere [it looks like] some nice quality and finish fast  primes :)[finally!], if the dynamic range and decent high iso are good ill be happy , it said to be polished with better menus
and all around goodness ....it has a flashi love the detachable grip , imm gonna create a complete custom grip
thru a combo of casting and.............phew

i was at adorama today  neither the x100 or 25mm 1.4 are anywhere to be seen  i was told the 12 f2 will be in about july 25 and they have 38 preorders
i was told dont bother preordering thell be plenty?  hope so

Offline candyspan6

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #20 on: July 08, 2011, 07:35:20 PM »
I haven't been around for a while because of posts just like this. People are falling all over themselves to defend a mediocre sensor that clearly performs, at best, equal to the previous sensors that Oly released. The AF is just a bunch of smoke and mirrors, and it's great if it can focus faster than a D3, but it's no where near the same camera. Try to take that same focus and do it in the dark, you won't be able to do it. Even if you did, you wouldn't be able to shoot at a ISO appropriate for the setting without using flash.

Some of the people on this thread bemoning other's disappointments of the poor ISO performance, are the same people that continue to tout the inflated ISO performance of their own cameras. Some people may criticize for criticisms sake, but it seems like people are also guilty of defending for defending sake. It's been a LONG time for Oly to come out with this camera, and they only have a tricky AF system to show for it. If it was something more I doubt we'd even be having this conversation.

I hate to troll, but sometimes there needs to be a voice of reason. Plus, I like coming by and reading these hilarious threads, as Panther correctly points out.

One more thing, the EP-3 also focuses faster than my Mamiya 7, but the Mamiya is leaps and bounds ahead. Let's start buying cameras because they take excellent pictures. For someone wanting to get into m4/3 on Olys side I'm sure the EP-3 will be fine. But it's not something for people to upgrade to, I'm sorry, the pictures speak for themselves...

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Panther

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #21 on: July 08, 2011, 07:55:47 PM »
The AF is just a bunch of smoke and mirrors,

Actually,
I think the improved auto-focus is the best thing going for the new digital PENS - much more so than the tweaked sensor.

I think they'll sell MORE due to auto-focus capability rather than sensor capability....

But I think you're right about the sensor.....Panasonic GH2 and GF3 have the clearly better sensor....
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 07:57:19 PM by Panther »

Offline voyager

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #22 on: July 08, 2011, 09:08:55 PM »
Olympus should have just kept the Panasonic sensor if the one that they release is as bad as this.

Seriously, I understand the need to want to defend Olympus, but it's 2011, and DSLR sensors stopped being that noisy at ISO 3200 in 2003.
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Panther

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #23 on: July 08, 2011, 09:43:51 PM »
Seriously, I understand the need to want to defend Olympus, but it's 2011, and DSLR sensors stopped being that noisy at ISO 3200 in 2003.

I'm glad that YOU said this.... :)
If I had said this, I would most certainly be highly criticized.... ;)

Offline count_zero

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Re: Not a "Tweaked" sensor
« Reply #24 on: July 08, 2011, 10:41:24 PM »
http://pekkapotka.com/

Quote
1)  The new Olympus m4/3 kit zoom lens 14-42mm 1:3.5-5.6 II R. Tested at 42mm focal length.
2)  Olympus m4/3 zoom lens 40-150mm 1:4-5.6. Tested at 50mm focal length.
3)  Olympus 4/3 zoom lens 12-60mm 1:2.8-4 with Novoflex m4/3 adapter. Tested at 50mm focal length.
4)  Panasonic Lumix G 20mm 1:1.7

        E-P3    E-P2        E-P3 is faster by
1)    0,82s    1,41s            42%
2)    0,89s    1,46s            39%
3)    1,96s    2,26s            13%
4)    0,87s    1,54s            44%

So how responsive E-P3 is then? Olympus claims it to be the fastest focusing camera of all system cameras. Lets see!
I repeated the same test with Nikon D3x and three Nikon lenses:

5)   AF-S Micro Nikkor 105mm 1:2.8 G
6)   AF Nikkor 85mm 1:1.4 D
7)   AF-S Nikkor 14-24mm 1:2.8 G. Tested at 24mm focal length.

D3x
5) 0,97s
6)1,15s
7)0,70s

Same test with the new Olympus M. Zuiko 12mm 1:2.0 lens. This lens is Olympus´ first lens that which they consider as belonging to the top level in their three level lens grading.

Test result with E-P3 0,74s.


Not bad results using legacy lenses.  Even the adapted 4/3 lens performs decently.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2011, 10:47:40 PM by count_zero »

 

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